Off-Season Cycle Advice.

[sussupps]

Hey guys,

I just finished a small 2 week lay-off after competing in my NABBA/WFF show. It's now grow time and I'm looking for advice in regards to what I should run.

My coach has recommended I try slin and growth this offseason @
10iu Humalog Pre Workout
1.5iu HGH in the middle of the night (was going to up it to 3iu)

I've got 5 kits of Medtropin on the way and have all the slin ready to go.

In terms of anabolics I was thinking of keeping it simple @
Test E 500-600mgs/wk
Dbol or Anadrol 50mgs/ED

Should I bother throwing in one of the follwing? Deca, EQ or Tren E?

[Powertard]

There is no sense in running hGH bellow 4 IU, unless you are over the age of 30 then 1-2 IU can be used as a replacement dose... heck even 0.1 IU I have seen used for anti aging.

Run 4 IU. 2 IU in morning as soon as you wake up, 2 IU at night right before bed. Both shot into delts. Rotate delts.

If you are going to run hGH then you may as well get the most out of your anabolics and use higher dosages. I assume you're in a lean state coming out of a show.

It depends on your size the dosages I'd run.

1 g test e
600 mg-800 mg/w deca
50 mg EOD-ED mast prop to keep conditioning and feel good factor
50 mg/d dianabol
50-100 mg/d anadrol
600-1000 mg/d TUDCA
If you don't want to use anadrol then blow up on high dose anadrol as it is amazing when lean. 150-200 mg/d.

Orals are 3 weeks on 2-3 weeks off depending on how you feel + LFT
Try and stay away from AIs. If you NEED one because you are getting legit gyno (hard painful lumps under nipples) then use 12.5 mg EOD aromasin to start with. If it gets worse get on 20 mg nolva and up the AI to 25 mg ED aromasin. Drop the nolva when gyno gets better and play around with aromasin dose to find lowest dose which works to keep gyno away.

[sussupps]

There is no sense in running hGH bellow 4 IU, unless you are over the age of 30 then 1-2 IU can be used as a replacement dose... heck even 0.1 IU I have seen used for anti aging.

Run 4 IU. 2 IU in morning as soon as you wake up, 2 IU at night right before bed. Both shot into delts. Rotate delts.

If you are going to run hGH then you may as well get the most out of your anabolics and use higher dosages. I assume you're in a lean state coming out of a show.

It depends on your size the dosages I'd run.

1 g test e
600 mg-800 mg/w deca
50 mg EOD-ED mast prop to keep conditioning and feel good factor
50 mg/d dianabol
50-100 mg/d anadrol
600-1000 mg/d TUDCA
If you don't want to use anadrol then blow up on high dose anadrol as it is amazing when lean. 150-200 mg/d.

Orals are 3 weeks on 2-3 weeks off depending on how you feel + LFT
Try and stay away from AIs. If you NEED one because you are getting legit gyno (hard painful lumps under nipples) then use 12.5 mg EOD aromasin to start with. If it gets worse get on 20 mg nolva and up the AI to 25 mg ED aromasin. Drop the nolva when gyno gets better and play around with aromasin dose to find lowest dose which works to keep gyno away.

Thanks for the in-depth response bro.
Since I've just come off a pretty intense blast pre-comp, should I not drop the dosages a bit to let my receptors/body have a bit of a break?

[Powertard]

No problem, I enjoy helping people

No such thing as receptor "damage" or "saturation" etc. It's a myth
It's all to do with myostatin levels and glycogen retention. A guy will go on a blast where myostatin levels are relatively low and also glyocogen isn't hyper saturated. Suddenly he goes on anadrol high test deca etc. First of all, muscles hyper saturate with glycogen and therefore also water. Every 1g of glycogen 3 g of water goes with it in muscle IIRC. This glycogen saturation causes you to gain weight very quickly, bros think it is contractile protein gain but it isn't, it's all glycogen and water for the main part so far. After IIRC 10 weeks, myostain levels raise to the point of homeostasis temporarily slowing down muscle gain, then falls once more at week 13 so gains speed up once more.
Also, people think your receptors get "clogged" etc because as you gain LBM, it becomes harder and harder to gain more! Guy on his first cycle will take 500 mg/w test and 100 mg anadrol and blow up from 180 lbs to 210 lbs in a few weeks then suddenly the gains slow down and he thinks it's because of "receptor clogging"... NOPE... just due to the afore mentioned points

Receptors actually upregulate when you take AAS. Ie you actually have MORE receptors when you take steroids!!

You always want to use hormones as lean as possible so you get maximal time to bulk on them. Honestly if I had come out of a show lean and ripped and say I was a natural I'd actually after eating a shit load of food and celebrating etc go and inject 500 mg test e 250 mg mast enth and take 100 mg anadrol the same day so I can maximize my results!

[Powertard]

Wait a sec
What orals were you running

Honestly, get blood work done to see where you stand. If liver enzymes and cholesterol is fucked then obviously stay offthe orals. Otherwise continue as normal wit injectables. get bloods done 3-4 wks later and they should be healthy then add in orals.

[sussupps]

I was using:
100mg Anavar
100mg Stana
100mg Proviron
50mg Halotestin (only for 7 days)
Clen
T3
Letro

Yea I reckon I'll get bloods done in the next week. I've put on quite a bit of weight since comp and have been getting pains in and around where my kidneys are. Could be due to excess water retention or just the fact I've fucked myself haha

[grotereber]

Let us know how the organ transplant goes bud!

[Powertard]

^lol

No but seriously, get blood work done before going on the orals

Also how is your BP?

[mrblue]

I was using:
100mg Anavar
100mg Stana
100mg Proviron
50mg Halotestin (only for 7 days)
Clen
T3
Letro

Yea I reckon I'll get bloods done in the next week. I've put on quite a bit of weight since comp and have been getting pains in and around where my kidneys are. Could be due to excess water retention or just the fact I've fucked myself haha

Most people confuse back pumps/pain with the kidneys. If you'd fucked your kidneys you would know about it.

If you've just finished using orals then i would take a break from them for now.

Always best to rotate orals, typically 4 weeks on 4 weeks off is what i've always heard. Mr Big gives some good advice on how he uses them in another thread.

If your in doubt always get your bloods checked by a doctor, there's a lot of shit and unnecessary fear mongering thrown about on bodybuilding boards about orals.

[sussupps]

^lol

No but seriously, get blood work done before going on the orals

Also how is your BP?

Just got bloods/urine analysis back.
All is sweet!

[Powertard]

lol holy shit I am amazed

carry on then! Oral time

[Serotonin101]

^^lol on gh15 a member improved his liver values while running superdrol...
Some people are gifted for this sport.
I don't get high hematocrit or BP issues. Yet I look at a vial of test and my nipple gets puffy.

As PT said, now is your time to grow! It's taking advantage of the rebound from depleting yourself. I'd keep it to more mild compounds: test, nandrolone, primo, eq, etc and cycle orals. Personally I say use them until you notice any issues. If money isn't an issue get liver values checked every 4-6 weeks while you test the waters with longer oral usage. Why come off if everything is in range? You could also incorporate a fast acting inject like test prop/pp/ace during your break from orals if you'd like. That's what I plan to do this fall is alternate drol/test pp.
Grow big my brother!

[Powertard]

LOL that is hilarious!! What was his SD dose and before and after levels?

[Serotonin101]

LOL that is hilarious!! What was his SD dose and before and after levels?

He was running only 10mg/day but still, that's a harsh compound. He posted his bw I believe but I'm too lazy to go digging

[Powertard]

eeehh 10 mg isn't that bad really
I ran 10 mg for 4 weeks and liver enzymes came back as AST ALT 20 and 34 respectively

[sussupps]

Spoke to my coach today. This is what he wants me on - thoughts?

Sust - 500 mgs weekly
Tren hex - 400 mgs weekly
Eq - 600 mgs
Anadrol 2 days on 50 mgs pre workout / 2 days on 50 mgs anavar pre workout ( rotate every 2 days )
12.5 mgs Aromasin daily

[Powertard]

I think your coach is on narcotics

[sussupps]

I think your coach is on narcotics

Hahaha fuck don't say that.

[Powertard]

lololol
no but seriously that cycle seems silly

[grotereber]

Why? test/tren + EQ isn't uncommon. the switching orals every two days is unnecessary but it'll still work. Anadrol is often given daily for 3+ months in medical cases.

[hasheagle]

off season cycle = feel good cycle = test e and mast e.

[brimmy]

Insulin at 10iu preworkout seems silly when eating some high gi carbs will get the average person a spike similar to 5-7iu. And personally I would recommend insulin post workout if you wanted one pin per day, 20iu post workout with a whole lot of carbs, and 1.5iu hgh is nothing especially when you're running generics, I wouldn't even bother with that. I would have the test higher or add in some deca and up the eq closer to 1g. Just my thoughts :).. No point running var in off season either keep drol and dbol in.

For example I am doing my first ever proper off season run and my doses are this, I've been on hormones for 16 months:
1500mg test e
1000mg eq
3.6iu hgh ed (pharma genotropin)
60-80iu insulin ed (humalog)
150mg anadrol ed

Insulin 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off. Anadrol 8 weeks on and 2 weeks off. Since starting that bulk approx 10 weeks ago I am up 16kg (35lb), I am eating very high calories and there will be substantial fat gains but there is plenty of muscle gained to.

[Serotonin101]

^^and let's be real, for us not using excessive gh and slin, we're not growing into a show so to maximize growth there will be some fat. Can always cut that later. Plus we're both young so what's one extra season to get comp ready ya know? Just more time to get that sick conditioning!

[Powertard]

16 Kg gain in 10 weeks!! Holy shit!!!!!!

[Serotonin101]

16 Kg gain in 10 weeks!! Holy shit!!!!!!

Lots of people blow up on slin. There was a guy who said he's seen people add 15 pounds in a couple days. I can only imagine the transformation from depleted weigh in look to blown up stage ready. Obviously it's not all muscle but glycogen super mega saturation and the water attached to it.

[Powertard]

I knew insulin seriously explodes you though I never thought it'd be 15 lbs in 2 days type explode lol

[Serotonin101]

I knew insulin seriously explodes you though I never thought it'd be 15 lbs in 2 days type explode lol

It would depend on how much muscle you have to inflate with glycogen and water. These people woukd be professionals who would go from maximum depleted state to full and round. I, personally, went from 155 depleted to 167 full in about 5 days coming off of high clen t3 and ec. No slin. No orals.

[Powertard]

Dan green went from like 218 to 25x in a few hrs
Completely glycogen depleted and dehydrated on lasix then bam shit loads of carbs, insulin, IV nutrients and water